trouble carving leaves

Thor · #1 02-09-2007, 09:29 AM

Mark said he would help me if he could on another thread with my leaf problem.
The first leaf is one I carved (with a lot of instruction and hands on help) in a workshop with Peter Benson. The other is one year later, and not working.
Yes, one is an acanthus and one is oak leaves, but something should apply. I've cut down from the flush surface about 3 times trying to get the three dimensional looking swoop to the leaves, and it always looks horrible.
Help will be hard, but appreciated
Thor

mark yundt · #2 02-09-2007, 11:45 AM

Hello,,glad you took me up on my offer.Leaves are such a valueable tool in a carvers bag of tricks in that they can be used in SO many places,picture frames,boxes,brackets,headboards,,well you get it,, the list goes on.That's why this is a good subject to learn even early on for new carvers,,make a leaf,learn your chisels, and have something to show or decorate something with.Sounds like the start of a good thread Christina (Thor).
Though size doesn't matter (chuckle,chuckle) and without references,, I 'm guessing the first might be about 6-7 inches square and the second maybe say,6x10 or so.I only ask so I can work in the same "scale" you are,,If I do a bigger one, I could do things you couldn't to some extent in a small one for example.
Next , I would like to know what you see in the piece.I know you said the second doesn't have the 3 dimensional look to it that you described.In a piece like this ,that I think is the single objective.But in the other,, is there anything there you are not happy with.The reason I ask is simply because there are more ways to carve and styles of Acanthus leaves than I could describe.This is one of them , and with just a bit of cleaning up will be a perfect representation of these leaves.Here you learned to roll and twist the leaf instead of just leaving it lay flat.Your instructor chose a good subject I feel,where he could demonstrate several design elements which will be used over and over in slightly different ways as you continue to carve and use leaves.He covered all the bases which is perfect.From this point you can just keep adding more and more to them,folds,eyelets,different shaped leaves and still have it be Acanthus.See,,,this is either a great starting point to jump off to other directions, or a completed leaf in this style.
The other thing I would like to know (boy , I sure am nosey aren't I?) Is what selection of tools you have. I would guess that you have a fairly broad selection seeing what you have done here,but again , it wouldn't be fair or instructive if I cheated and use one or two of my special "magic" chisels ( they're hard to find and VERY pricey) LOL, Oh ,, I crack myself up! But this can be done with the most basic selection of chisels if anyone else is contemplating following along.
I can't promise that this will be a rapid succession of posts and pics,,'ya gotta give me a bit of time as I'm keeping busy with work,,but I can't wait to get going on this,,THIS IS GOING TO BE FUN,,,,Thank you for letting me help.

Thor · #3 02-09-2007, 12:09 PM

Ok,
I'll start by answering your question about what tools I have.
I use mallet size pheil's...
7/14
5/20 use this a lot
5/8 use this a lot
9/13 use this a lot
7/6
11/3
71/20
8a/13
1/8
12/16
8/4
1s/8
12a/8

The sizes you guessed are correct.
the acanthus leaf is on a 6" X 6" board
the leaves on the oak tree measure about the same size as the acanthus leaf on a board that measure 8" X 12" .
My main trouble is getting the depths and curves in a 3-D sense. I have a deep board (1") and have carved it down a good bit erasing my previous work due to the results just being icky.
The real frustrating part is that I really thought I had that "light came on" moment when I took the workshop. It just didn't follow me home.
thanks again, and I'll be very patient with your attention.
The intrique about those "magic" chisels has me wondering what they are too.
Christina

mark yundt · #4 02-09-2007, 12:54 PM

HaaHaa,, now you cracked me up! You have plenty of chisels obviously to do this.There might be some slight variations ,but as long as anyone out there has chisels close to these they'll work just fine.Funny,,,the 5's are my favorite too,,especially the 5/12,,middle of the pack,so versatile.It can act flat or curved,,it doesn't know what it wants to be,,so I tell it. Yeah, I talk to my chisels,,curse at them too when they're bad.Until we get this show on the road I decided to post a 'coupla pics to show the versatility of these leafy things.Here is a pair of columns done for a fireplace with the oak and acorns as we're doing,,these were very thin,,not much wood.There is a stylish capital with grapes,vines and the leaves,a pierced panel used to cover a heating/air unit in a chapel,with a shallow cabinet under it to hold the priests vestments,and a pair of accent pieces for an entry door in N.Y. I've also posted a bigger picture in the members galleries that wouldn't look right compressed here that shows 4 different door panels and corner treatments I did for a cabinet company to display my "wares". I know I have somewhere photos of 6 panels I did ,each with different species of tree leaves in 1 ft sq. relief carvings that look just like what you're doing here. If and when I find them I"ll post them as well just to get your wheels turning with possibilities

doris · #5 02-09-2007, 03:37 PM

first leaf is really nice,thor , and design for second too. i believe you will make it wonderful carving :-)
may i ask here about leaf too ? i am carving an acanthus leaf, and have the tip roll over. i dont know how thin i should carve it. i have all cut of this roll over, but not sure if it should or can be thinner. it looks a little chubby now. i want it look believalble, but also am afraid of cutting too thin so wood breaks (i am working on a 15x24cm board of limewood) what is the idea here ?

mark yundt · #6 02-09-2007, 10:42 PM

AH HA,, found them,, knew I just sent them out to someone,,stuck between the CPU and the cabinet. The photo quality isn't so hot,,but you'll get the idea anyway. Hopefully tonight I'll get to start on making your piece,,if not tommorrow,, till then here are some other ideas.6 panels..6 species,,oak, poplar,walnut,cherry,maple & birch.These were neat,, they went around the front of a reception desk,, when the panels were lined up , you could see an overall wave like line connecting the panels,one started with the branch in the upper left and the branch swept down to the lower right,, the next one started inthe lower left and swept to the upper right,,again and again,,the main branch created the wave like line through them all..enjoy.

Thor · #7 02-10-2007, 12:27 AM

Wonderful work. I look forward to hearing more.
Doris, good luck with your carving. maybe we will both learn something here.
Thor

wade clark · #8 02-10-2007, 01:45 AM

Mark,
Very nice! Wonderful idea! what better way to get to know trees intimately!
Wade

mark yundt · #9 02-10-2007, 04:54 AM

For most people probably would be,,an Oak could fall on me and I'd wonder what it was. But I think there is a certain irony in this type of project,,take a living tree,, cut it down,, so I could recarve it to look like the tree,,,,in it's own wood,,,scratched my head for a while over that one.

mark yundt · #10 02-11-2007, 04:26 PM

Hello Christina (Thor). Had a bit of time and made a reasonable copy of your carving to have something to start from.I think I caught the essence of your piece,most of the major elements and carving marks. If I missed something let me know and I'll change it.I lit it from 2 directions so you could see it better, I think we might be close enough to start.

Also, if anyone else has any questions or comments/adivce,please feel free to speak up.