Teddy Needs Help!

Lynn O. Doughty · #1 05-30-2008, 06:04 PM

I've been collecting uniform details for Teddy but I can't figure out what he has on his belt. This is the best picture I could find which shows it but it'
s not detailed enough to pick out the details. I think it's a strap to hold his sword. Anybody got any better idea or even better yet a better photo of whatever it is. Thanks. here's the actual link:
Medal of Honor, Colonel Theodore Roosevelt and the Rough Riders by Theodore Roosevelt Association

Kenny_S · #2 05-30-2008, 06:34 PM

Lynn, the best I could do for you is this site:
http://www.theodore-roosevelt.com/trroughbig.jpg

Looks like what you said.

Claude · #3 05-30-2008, 08:09 PM

Lynn:
I think that is the strap for his sabe;. I had a similar one on the sword I had as a Navy officer... Near the belt is a "hook" that a ring on the sword scabbard hooks to, and the strap hooks to another ring lower on the scabbard.
Here's a couple more links for you:

Army Sabers/Swords Manual of Arms; Field Manual 3-21.5: Drill and Ceremonies, Appendix F
Swords or Sabers? What is the proper term for the Army, Marines, West Point, and Air Force Academy Sabers?
and this one just for completeness

Navy Officer Swords (Sabers) by Marlow White & WKC

Claude

Lynn O. Doughty · #4 05-31-2008, 07:11 AM

Claude: Thanks for that information I think it's just what I'm looking for. To be clear, would you say that he would have the strap at the far back along with the one hanging from his side. I just watched "Fort Apache" last night and all of the officers in that movie had that back strap hooked to the other somehow when they didn't have the sword attached. Would that be correct? ALso, do you think it would be appropriate to put a sidearm on his right side? Just want to get things right.

Again, really appreciate your help.

Thomp · #5 05-31-2008, 07:57 AM

lynn, '

looks like a little extra fob hanging beyond the scabbard harness (the photo falls apart in high zoom.) but it may be a special calvary rig to hold the sword more horizontal while mounted...

at first glance i was going to suggest it was a seat belt HA!.....

AlArchie · #6 05-31-2008, 08:17 AM

Lynn, in all the photos I've seen of TR with the Rough Riders, he's had a revolver strapped on, but it was in a covered flap style holster. We used that style holster untill we switced to the Sig semi-auto. If you need a photo of my holster I can post one. (ours looks a bit more polished than TR's) We wore ours "cross draw" on the left side, though.

Al

Lynn O. Doughty · #7 05-31-2008, 09:40 AM

Thanks for all the input. I think I'm going to have to take a little "artistic license" with his belt attachments. Will no doubt immediately find out from some viewer when I first show him that I have it all wrong. I hate that as from then on I always look at the piece thinking it's not right.

Al, thanks for that photo. That's the type of gun holster I was going to use but I see he has it strapped on reverse of it's normal position. Wonder if he was left handed??

Hi_Ho_Sliver · #8 05-31-2008, 10:06 AM

Lynn I think he had the pistol on the right side because he is right handed and had the sword as a crossdraw...the guy two people over has his holster vertical as I believe Teddys would have been, but you notice , he has his hand on the pistol grip. Looking forward to this carving, should be a good one. Oh, not exactly sure, but think the leather strap went true a square loop on the scabbard..not sure about the other connection, the reason I am thinking that is that metal would have clanked in action.....not desirable in a stealthy move LOL

Lynn O. Doughty · #9 05-31-2008, 10:59 AM

Dave. In the movie last night they were clanking all over the place! No wonder they lost at the Big Horn. The redskins heard them coming back when they were still in Oklahoma!

Claude · #10 05-31-2008, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lynn O. Doughty

Claude: ... To be clear, would you say that he would have the strap at the far back along with the one hanging from his side. I just watched "Fort Apache" last night and all of the officers in that movie had that back strap hooked to the other somehow when they didn't have the sword attached. Would that be correct? ALso, do you think it would be appropriate to put a sidearm on his right side? ...

The normal way we taught to wear the sword (same I think applies to Sabers - at least for Marines) was that the top loop on the scabbard hung on the belt hook, the long strap was put onto the lower loop, and the short strap was attached to the top loop. Here's a link that clearly shows the belt:
Navy Officer Sword Package
The leather strap was on the aft side of the scabbard (toward Teddy's rear...)
How to Wear the Navy Sword - instructions and photos

By the way, notice the sword knot, which as a gold cloth strap wrapped around the finger guard a few times and then hangs down...

Here's another link to Army stuff. They apparently use a saber chain, instead of a leather strap now.
Army Officer Saber Package

I believe the cavalry wore their swords on the left and a pistol on the right, if right handed. The pistol holster would have been relatively high up on the waist, as was the belt, and not down on the hips. One thing I don't know is if the pistol holster would have been a cross-draw or not. In the Navy, ours were not, but turn of the century Army may have had different rules; just don't know. I think I remember reading that a lot of the Civil War cavalry had a cross draw holster for the their smaller handguns, while the large Colt Walkers were hung on the saddle...