[Mottles]

A friends husband has ask me if I'd woodburn a deer or elk on his maple rifle stock. He saw the pheasant and lantern I woodburned and really like them. I told him I had no experience with woodburning on a gun stock let alone enough woodburning experience to take on someones prized rifle. He insisted he had lots of confidance in my ability. duh..I told him I'd have to research the technique and get back to him.
I told him that he'd have remove any protective stain/varnish/oil before I could work on it.
I guess my question to you all is (1.) Anyone done this type of thing for yourself or someone? If so please advise if you would how you did it. (2.) Any good books out there on woodburning gun stocks?
I'm not sure about burning on wood that has been stained--and would the sanding remove most of the stain and stain/varnish/oil.
I must admit it really would be a challenge but one I think I would enjoy.
I'm I nuts??? Don't answer that!!!! tee hee
All advice, comments and recommendations welcome.
Kathy
Note: I just found a book by Bill Janney "Gunstock Carving" here at Fox Chapel. As I haven't tried relief carving yet not sure it would help me? Does anyone have this book and if so any thing on woodburning? Also another thought came to my little mind--thoughts of maybe working on a replacement gunstock of same type? Need to research as that might solve part of my task. I don't have a clue the $$$$$$ of gunstocks.........Where's that search engine......LOL

[Ashbys]

You should have no problem with the stock. It should burn rather eaisly. You said his stock was maple? Only reason I am asking is most modern firarms, are usally walnut. But maple was used in most long rifles. Flintlock , percussion 1700's.

I will give you the information for both. If the gun is an older gun chances are the finish is likly to be tung oil. This will mean that there will or should be oil in the fibers. I don't think it will be possible to clear it out of the gun without sanding down below the present finish. So your request to remove the finish is the first step. Also , the refinishing process will be important. So step by step
1. Remove the old finish and clear away all signs of stain.
2. Remove all nicks/ dings which might be in the area you will be working with.
3. (important )Bring the wood to a finish sand ready to stain, or oil coat. As the burning is not a deep impression the stock must be ready before the burn to finish as seconday sanding will remove some of the burn.
4. Place your pattern
5. Do your burn
6. clean your burn, for loose carbon chips which could flake off when the oil finish is added.
7. stain as needed
8 seal with tung oil
9 lightly steel wool 0000 wool or higher
10 seal again
11 repeat step 8 and 9 until desired finish.

I strongly suggest the entire gun have the finish removed, as if not it might very well 2 tone on him. Where he would have the new finish not matching the old.

The burn should be no problem , but the finishing is where the real time will come in. Many stock carvers will use burning for improved detail, the only issue being the carbon flaking as with any burn.
Sounds like a great project, and a lot of fun. If it was combined with a carving , you would have less work as the removal of the first finish would not be a great issue as you would cut through it to reach the non oiled wood.
Would love to see it when finished so keep us informed .

Ash

[Irish]

Hey Kathy,

I doubt that the maple stock has been stained. Usually they leave the wood the natural coloring. I do agree that any of the vanish or polyurethane would need to be removed before you do any work. You don't want to be burning through a finishing layer both because of the fumes and the possiblilities of scorching the varnish layer. He, the gun owner, would want to remove the polyurethane from the entire stock ... not just the area that he wants you to burn. That way when the new layer of finishing is added it will match without any clouding.

Now, Michael, my beloved hubby and an avid riflerman, says that a maple stock is very unusally because of it's very pale coloring. You will want to check if it's Bird's Eye Maple ... the Bird's Eyes may not burn at all. Any maple has some bird's eye grain to it which means you will be hitting areas of very dense graining. We both, Mike and I, suggest that you get some maple and practice first!

Now, in my humble opinion and presuming that you would explore how maple burns, I have every confidence that you have the artist skills to tackle the commission. The work that you have been sharing here on the forum is excellent ... No wonder that he wants YOU to do the job.

Susan

[Irish]

Ash,

If, as you suggest, the rifle is a flintlock or percussion circa 1700's or even into the mid-1800's, if refinishing the surface of the gunstock would not destroy much of the monetary value of the rifle???

My Dad use to restore pre-Civil War rifles but he did so trying to conserve as much of the original patina as possible. He was even extremely careful to keep the patina of the rust on the barrels. I don't know how many mornings we woke up to pans of oiling gun parts and rifle barrels being hung in the patio door for 'browning'.

???

Susan

[Ashbys]

Susan,

If the gun was indeed an orginial, yes beyond a doubt it would reduce the value of the rifle. I asumed that when she said maple that it was a reproduction of an 1700 - early 1800 flinlock or percussion rifle. These guns are still being made as many states have hunting seasons designed around them. And some are in themself works of art. I was lucky to attend the NRA auction last month where a 20 guage turkey gun was sold, it brought $8000.00. The gunsmith has made many of the flintlocks many bringing in over $20000.00. But they are indeed reproductions and unless it is made by a recongized smith the price can vary greatly.

Most of the maple stocks used are flame and tiger maple. They intentially look for burled wood to get the best wood grain patterns. These stock are usally presented as a grade 5 , but many are much simplier. Very few are birseye maple, mostly because of possible cracks in the stocks resulting from the grain. But they are indeed out there.

Kathy if you could get a pic, or a name identifing the maker or the gun style I think I could help you more. Certain manufacturers use specific woods, also most styles can be traced to give a lot of detail. Also some guns are intentionally finish to look like one thing and then they are something else.

So yes Susan , I made a couple of assumtions , one is the gun is a reproduction, and the second that he really knew the wood.

Ash

[Irish]

Ash,
My Michael says in the background as I read him your posting ... "RIGHT!"

Mike says he never even considered an antique ... he was thinking along the lines of something modern. He also is a little envious that you got to be at the auction!

Susan

[wade clark]

I had a 300 Savage with a maple stock. It may have been an aftermarket stock, I don't know. It was the prettiest gun I ever owned! No carving or burning, just awesome wood attached to an awesome gun! I often dreamed of carving it and if I had it today I'd do just that. There are some maple stocks on modern rifles, though I don't know if they are all aftermarket...surely you can order a new one with maple, I'd think.
Wade

[Ashbys]

Wade,
To get a maple stock on a mass manufactured gun today I would say a 98 percent chance it would have to be a custom order. ly, a large majority of guns are being changed to fiberstocks. But I can not tell you how long it has been since I saw anything except walnut or birch on a new non custom rifle, except for fiber. Not saying they are not out there just that I have not seen them.

Ash

[Mottles]

Ash, Susan THANK YOU, THANK YOU for your enlightening discussion on my behalf! Wade THANK YOU also for your input too I'm going to need all the help I can get.
Wow I'm so impressed with the knowledge of working on gunstock you all have. I'm both excited and nervous all at the same time. I know one thing for sure I need to get more info from John about his rifle. In thinking back on our conversation he wasn't exactly sure the type of wood but 'thought' it maple. I would be surprised if it were an antique surely he wouldn't want anything done to it. I don't think I'd take the on the project if it were an antique. I like old heritage and would hate the thought of burning that old wood.
I'll talk with John again soon and find out make, model, manufacturer and year. Also tell John that it is important for me to know the type of wood and why.
Thank you for your confidance I really appreciate it very much. I'll share what I find out. I can tell you this John is a perfectionist and I can only guess this is a beautifully maintain rifle. Makes me more nervous! I really would like to do the complete stock not just the butt so the finish would look complete and not patchy.
Will keep you posted on what I find out!
Thanks again for your help,
Kathy
Note: Yes, good idea I'll get pictures and post them to this thread. If I take on this project maybe a Work In Progress would be good.

[Ashbys]

Kathy a good pic , of the stock would help a lot. Almost all maple stock are aftermarket, replacement stocks, so it is possible to be maple even if the man and model would lend to saying it isn't. The picture and finish would almost show if the stock had been changed.

The usual spot for noticing this are at the butt end where the barrel attaches to the stock, and along the carriage where it attaches, there will usually be a bump or slight mismatch. Even the best gunsmith have a hard time making the rematch perfect.

Hope this helps

Ash