[slivers&dust]

I received a Tormek sharpening system from my father with a number of accessories, VHS tape, Books, etc. He never got the hang of it and thought I would have more patience with it so…

After watching the video and reading the book, ok skimming the book. I set it up in the basement and grabbed my chisels thinking finally I’ll be able to put an edge on them that will cut in any direction. (mainly a power carver so I never bothered with them before)

Well, let me tell’ya…they make it look easy in the video. I figured out most everything ok, like setting the angle, flattening and the candle or line of light thing…but my first attempt on a #10 20mm gouge was not so good. Second attempt was no better. Third attempt it cut with the grain great, cross grain not so good and against the grain, well lets not go there. (btw that was at 22.5 degrees)

I searched the forum and found out that some of you are setting the angle at 15 to 17.5 degrees for cutting Basswood and Butternut. I’m going to try that tonight, but I was hoping to get any other pointers from you that use this system (other than don’t give up and it takes practice) What have you learned over time, tip & tricks that kind of info.

I should mention too that one thing I was a bit unclear about was which jig to use. I have the SVD-185 and what looks like an early version of the SVS-32, mine only has the flange on one side. I tried them both and so far have gotten the better results using the SVD-185 once I figured out there is a 0 setting. Again this one too must be an earlier version because it doesn’t have a 0 but the one in the book does, which I have 3 of; a new one, an old one and an insert for the two jigs, all a bit different.

I’m thinking of ordering the SVS-32 as it makes sense to have the two flanges to keep the jig from rotating, like the one I have does.

Which jig do you use?
Will I really need the SVS-32 or does the SVD-185 cover everything?


Any help would be appreciated.

[Dan C]

Tony,

I've had a Tormec system for 3 or 4 years now and love it, but do agree with you that its not as easy as it looks on the video! I haven't used all the jigs but can probably offer some helpful comments.

I've used 2 of the jigs so far - the SVS-32 and what I think is the SVH-60. I say that I think it's the SVH-60, because it's not stamped with any designation on the jig itself. I matched up what I have with the picture in the instruction book.

I use the SVH-60 for all my straight edge chisels and SVS-32 for all my rounded edge gouges.

I don't have any experience with the single flange jig you mention, but the SVS-32 works like a charm. I see the double flange as very important, and would recommend that you go ahead and invest in one.

If you don't know what the SVH-60 looks like, see if you can look it up on the Tormek site. It basically clamps the gouge in a vise-like grip and then rides along the universal support. There are a couple of guide holes on the jig, and the universal support rod goes through them so that the jig can be slid back and forth along the support as you sharpen. Also, by the way, I don't use this jig as the book recommends, which is to grind toward the edge with the Universal support placed vertically. I grind away from the edge with the support placed horizontally. I haven't tried it their way, but have had excellent luck my way. If you don't have this jig, I would suggest that you get it as well.

And now for a couple of tips.

Tip 1
In the Tormek instruction book, they state "It does not help if we sharpen and hone the bevel to perfection, if the back is not equally flat and smooth." This is so true. For all my flat chisels, I put a mirror finish on the back side near the cutting edge using a small piece of plate glass and successively finer grit wet/dry sand paper. Start with maybe 220 grit and move on down to maybe 600 grit. Just lay the back side of the chisel flat on the sandpaper which is on the plate glass and grind it around and around. No special esoteric skill is involved. Just get the back side nice and flat and very smooth.

Tip 2
IMHO, I don't think it's possible to get the edge you need for carving with just the Tormek system itself. I'ts a pretty good edge, but you need to buff it further to a mirror finish. I have two buffing wheels set up (cloth layered disk with the layers sewed together) - one with brown tripoli buffing compound and one with red rouge buffing compound. Use the Tormek buffing wheel to get the metal burr off the edge, and grinding wheel marks off the cutting edge, and then buff the back side and bevel side first using the brown tripoli compound wheel and then the red rouge compound wheel. Dip the gouge end in water as you do this to keep it cool. Since you are not removing metal, the gouge isn't going to overheat and lose its temper. This makes all the difference in the world!

One more point - I checked my gouges, and they have an angle between 20 and 25 degrees. Don't get too hung up on this. The angle doesn't make too much difference if you have a good sharp edge. With this angle range, I find that, even with soft wood like butternut or basswood, and not using a mallet, I still occasionally lose my edge because of very small chipouts on the cutting edge, and I have very good quality chisels. With the Tormek system, and the two buffing wheels, it's easy to quickly put the edge back on. If you are going to carve hard woods with a mallet, you will definitely need to increase this angle.

The one gouge type I have problems with are V gouges. I'm still working on that.

Hope this all helps!

Dan C.

[mdallensr]

One important step in sharpening is to grind the edge square before you start grinding the bevel. If you don't, you'll really struggle to get the edge sharpened uniformly. As you grind, check for the "line-of-light" and adjust to grind only the portions of the edge that need it. You have to get the wire edge across the entire edge before you move to the leather strop. It's easy to think you've ground enough, since it's difficult to see the wire edge, but if you go to the leather strop before you've finished grinding, you'll strop for a long time and still have some spots that aren't sharp. Use a bright lamp and a magnifier to check the line-of-light. Keep checking the tool on a piece of basswood and look carefully for drag marks. Once you do a couple of tools correctly, all of the steps will fall into place. After I'm done with the leather strop, I finish by polishing my tools on a cotton wheel. You can use that to put a secondary bevel on the inside of the bevel and to make sure the inside of the bevel is smooth.

I've used the palm tool jig and the full size tool jig and both work well for several brands of carving tools.

[slivers&dust]

Thanks to both of you for the advice.

I didn’t get a chance to work with it last night but did look at the older paperback book and found that the jig I have is a SVS-40 jig for straight gouges. The other thing I found was that I was using it wrong and boy do I feel stupid …now that I see how it should work.

The single flange should be in between the grinding wheel and the tool rest. The tool itself rotates on the shank behind the flange on the tool rest.
I had seen how the SVS-32 short tool jig (double flange) was used in the hardback book and assumed the #40’s single flange was placed outside the tool rest and the frame of the jig rotated on the tool bar…wrong! Not realizing that the TOOL was rotating on the bar when using the #32 jig…oops! Everything makes a lot more sense now.

@ Dan I looked in the box of accessories and found that I do have SVH-60 straight edge grinding jig

@mdallensr by “wire edge� do you mean when the line of light is completely gone and the tool edge appears sharp?

Most of my gouges will cut across the grain, but don’t leave that smooth cut I’m after. I do have a #5-20 that cuts across so smooth with that cool cutting sound and leaves such a smooth cut that the wood has that shiny iridescent look to it. That’s what I’m aiming for in all of them…eventually.

I have a small bench grinder (6� – ½ hp – 3450 rpm) that I almost never use that I can try to find a couple buffing wheels for and give that a go too.

[wade clark]

Congratulations! What a nice thing to inherit!
I have the buffing wheels set up on my Tormek and only use the grinding wheel when I've damaged a tool. I use the leather buffing wheels a lot and love them! I have every jig and only used 2 so far, but plan on playing with a few others at a time until I figure them all out. What a tool! Still, when I get a gouge really messed up (I buy used tools on ebay) I send it to Rick!
Wade

[slivers&dust]

Over the weekend I was able to rework my #10/20 gouge using the jig “the right way” and got the angle right. I was able to get it pretty sharp just using the leather wheel. Its not the best looking edge do to the first attempted edge grinding going to far up the wings …but it works. The majority of the rest only needed honing, with just a couple needing shaping.

I also was able to find a couple polishing wheels for the bench grinder. I quickly realized that it rotates in the wrong direction so I removed the shrouds ends, swapped sides with them and turned the grinder around. Now I’m able to remove the scratches and polish them like a “chrome bumper” and the best part is now they ALL cut in all directions.

I even started working on Mark G’s tutorial, carving the Mt. Man Mask, this weekend. I’m definitely still a beginner when it comes to using “hand tools only”, but so far having sharp tools takes that frustration out of the equation.

[Dan C]

Tony,

Fantastic! I think honing on those buffing wheels is really important. I thought I was working with sharp gouges, and then I took a week-long wood carving class at John Campbell Folk School in North Carolina this past summer. What a great experience!

Anyway, the instructor picked up one of my gouges to demonstrate, and immediately told me that it needed sharpening. He cut a groove across grain with mine and then took his gouge and made the same cut. My cut had a lot of little rough places in the bottom of the groove where the wood fibers had been lifted up rather than cut. His was nice and smooth. He took me over to the buffing wheel and in about a minute had put a beautiful edge on mine so that it cut like his. All it took was that additional buffing step.

That was a real learning experience! It's moments like that, that are really valuable, or maybe I should say invaluable.

Anyway, good luck on your carving! I'm basically a beginner like you, although I'm starting to gain a little experience.

Dan C.

[mdallensr]

The "wire edge" is the burr that forms when you've ground through the steel. At that point, there is a slight flimsy burr on the edge. You need to hone or strop that off, leaving a perfectly sharp edge. If you don't create the wire edge, you still have a line-of-light, dull spot on your cutting edge. That spot will leave a trail of drag marks in the wood. If your cut isn't perfectly clean, even shiny, you edge isn't sharp.

Be careful to not grind after you've established the wire edge. If you do, you'll probably lose the square edge you started with and you'll end up with a wavy edge on your gouge. If that gets bad, you get to cheerfully start over. Be patient; it really does work!. Mike

[Dan C]

Tony,

To follow up on Mike's comments - Rick-in-Seattle, in a previous post, defines wire burr as follows:

(Wire) In this case means a thin flap of metal attached to the cutting edge of the tool. Being too fine for the abrasive to remove, it simply deflects when pressure is applied.

You can usually see this wire edge quite clearly when you get to the point where you have ground down to a sharp cutting edge. Sometimes the wire burr looks almost like filings that are standing out from the cutting edge. When you try to wipe them off, they don't wipe off because they are still attached. You have to buff them off. Usually, you can't see the cutting edge because it's actually obscured by this burr.

The other point Mike makes is to stop grinding when the burr appears or you will get a wavy edge. That's a point I hadn't actually thought about. I have usually kept grinding once the wire burr appeared just to make sure I was where I needed to be. Then I've wondered why the edge was wavy. So great, I've picked up one more useful piece of info!

Dan C.

[slivers&dust]

Thanks for the info on the “wire edge� guys

I thought you were supposed to grind only until the line of light disappeared, which would keep the edge from getting wavy. (I am using a strong light and magnifying visor to check)

It sounds like that when the line of light has completely disappeared the wire edge develops, so as it starts to appear in small sections at a time I need to carefully keep working the areas that it has not, then hone it off, buff & polish and then it will be sharp.

What I thought, yet again, was sharp, now that I’m into this carving (no longer a flat surface) I’ve again found that maybe the tools aren’t as sharp as I thought they were, still better then before though.

Grabbing the Foredom and sneaking up the carving is a lot easier for me but I do want to learn how to use just hand tools so I’ll try sharpening them again.