[Just Carving]

I have been thinking about making carving gouges. But I realized I need a critical bit of information. What are the radii of the gouges? A #3 has a larger radii than a #9. So I would use a larger diameter dowel to form the inside radius of #3 than what I would use for a #9. But what is the actual radius or diameter of the dowel?

I am also assuming I would be holding the inside radius of the gouge as opposed to the outside radius of the gouge.

Is there a standard that sets the dimensions for a manufacturer to make the gouges?

Can anybody help me?

Thanks,
Bob

[Plain_Ol_Ed]

Yes there is a standard and no not every (any?) manufacturer follows it. Even the ones that follow it will vary somewhat. For instance a #3 Denny is slightly flatter than a #3 Ramelson. A number 2 from most manufacturers is a skew chisel, but from Pfeil it's a flat gouge (flatter than a #3). In general you've got the correct idea, small numbers are flatter and large numbers are quicker. Grab a woodcraft catalog , they have pictures that will get you in the ballpark.

[Plain_Ol_Ed]

let me try this

[Old_Gord]

There are a couple of terms you are going to run into which apply to carving tools, London Pattern and Sheffield List, these are the standards for shapes, profiles and numbering system which British tool makers adhere to "generally".
What other country manufacturers use I have no idea and in some cases I don't think they do either.
Also because a lot of these gouges are hand forged, you will find slight differences depending I guess on how long the form for a particular sweep has been in continual use as there is some wear over time.
As you might have noticed in Plain Ol Ed's post Ashley Iles uses the London Pattern for his/their gouges.
Before you embark on this journey you also might want to purchase Chris Pye's excellent book(s)
"Woodcarving , Tools, Materials & Equipment" , older version was one book , revised edition consists of two books.
He provides all the info you will need to produce your own gouges as far as shape, size, care etc., the info he provides will be something you find yourself refering to all through your life as a carver.
Now if you want to try and make yourself a set of palm tools, take a look at this site;
http://www.scavm.com/gouges.htm
These are made from hacksaw blades so no round stock is needed..
tool making.

OG

[Plain_Ol_Ed]

I'm with old_gord, get the Pye book ... every carver should have it. Many, many questions are answered. It also doesn't hurt to subscribe to his on-line newsletter (it's free).

I have no idea where these italics came from!

[Just Carving]

Wow! Talk about quick responses! for everybody!

Thank you one and all! It's going to be a crummy weekend--weatherwise, and I had hoped to get a jump on making the gouges since I won't be doing much yard work because of the rain. So hopefully I'll be ing away!

Ed--thanks for the tips on the differences in the tools. That was one of the things I was wondering about because I kinda figured each manufacturer would have its own quirks in the tools they make. I like Denny tools but with the handles I am making which are more contoured for my "mitts".

OG--thanks for the link to the gouge making method site. I had envisioned doing something like that but hadn't gotten to the mechanics of it yet. Now you helped me nail that part down. Thanks again.

I have Chris Pye's "Lettercarving in Wood"--excellent book. So, I will probably get the "Woodcarving , Tools, Materials & Equipment". I have looked at some of the freebies on his website, but haven't registered for the newsletter yet. I'll have to do that.

Hopefully I will have pice of some good results to post soon--that is after I get done learning my mistakes.

Thanks again,
Bob

[rales]

Bob,

I think radius is the wrong word to use in this case - because it depends on the size of the tool, i.e. a 3mm #3 and a 20mm #3 have totally different radii and could not be produced in the same die. The 3mm would come out more of a #1.5. Chris Pye expalins this in his Materials book... a progressive set in size of the same sweep will not produce a circle (stop cuts) but rather a spiral that goes from large to small.

You might well use the same die to create a 3mm #3 as a 20mm #7 - depends the width of the steel and how far you want to wrap it up the sides...

I second the opinion of the others in getting a catalog (Wood Carvers Supply also has one with sweeps) and maybe a set of dowels and measuring what tools you have to see what works... it will be the inside sweep you want.

Thanks Old Gord for that site! Great stuff

By the way I'm rales - new around here. Very nice place... I'll update my profile soon.

peace, rales

[big_Wayne_P]

here is The Sheffield List

[big_Wayne_P]

here is another showing gouges and #

[Just Carving]

Thanks Rick--I posted under your Howdy thread.

I agree with what your saying about the "radii". I saw that the #3 gouges' radii varied from one width to the next. I think I will do a best fit tooling based on what I want, i.e. depth of curve and width of gouge, using the charts that have been posted as a guide. Thanks.

Thanks Wayne for the images. I had seen a reference to the Sheffield List, but I hadn't located it on the Internet. You saved me some hunting.

I did come a cross an interesting tidbit--not sure if I understand how to apply it. But I guess it is a bit of history of how gouges were developed.

Here's a link.

http://www.americanlongrifles.com/Wo...pen-tools2.htm

Pan down to the paragraph titled "Carving Gouges". It talks about the "Golden Mean Derived Volute".

I found another website that explains how to lay out the volute.
Here's a link.

http://www.nexusjournal.com/AndGal.html

Uhhh--like I said--I'll just use the charts that you guys were kind enough to provide me. Sheesh--talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill!

Bob