Steps in a relief carving

[-JBergs-]

fellow relievers;

Perhaps a few of you more experienced folk could help us newbie's out in listing for us the chronological steps in producing a relief carving; e.g.,

1. Design and Layout
2. Transfer of pattern to wood
3. (this step and hereafter is where I'd like further clarification); maybe this step is to make stop cuts and begin roughing out or "bosting" ?
4. Begin modeling the work by rounding and giving proper proportions to each element in the work?

I've never worked alongside someone so common sense has led me to the above approach but I'm sure there are things I'm missing or am not thinking about.

Would appreciate any feedback! Thanks.

[doris]

hi jbergs... here are some projects on wci you can follow to see how we do it... to your points,,, yes 1, yes 2 if needed, yes 3 and bosting means finding the basic rough shapes, and, make stopcuts not too deep at the begiining, so you have room the improve on mistakes, yes 4 but modeling is not only rounding, but makeing the shapes correct. the proportions should have be done correct already in 3, while the bosting session (and if you work from a pattern it should be already drawn in correct proportions !!) ... as said, here is a grapevine project, and mine too, where you can look in detail how we approach things in relief carving. ... and, the best is, just to start a small project to see how things "beg" to be done. as you said, most goes by common sense...

[-JBergs-]

Hi Doris; thanks a million for your reply...I've actually been to your homepage and to your blog w/ Mark - I love all your work and appreciate any feedback from you!

Question; your first sentence noted "here are some projects on wci you can follow..." but I didn't notice any links to them... did I miss something? very interested to start a new project that I can follow along with someone more experienced...

Thanks again!

[doris]

here are the links i meant for you :
Grapevine Relief Project
alphonse mucha panel wip

[pallin]

JBergs - Step 3 includes all the sub-steps that define relief carving. As Doris noted, you make stop cuts and begin removing wood, but what? You study your design and decide which parts are in the foreground, middle ground and background. Then you remove wood to the maximum depth for the background, half the depth for the mid-ground. Some reliefs require more "levels." The shaping and texturing of objects comes toward the last.

[doris]

yes, phil that is right,,,but i would prefer not emphasis levels, its rather that you try to see the object you want carve in relief in a "compressed form", like when you press on an ballon, say, and it gets flatter...you want do exactely such with the shapes in relief..when you think too much of levels, the "live" goes out the carving, and something mechanical is left...its good to think forms and shape always. my first relief was a portrait, never thought of levels, but only "how can i carve the nose here in such little depth,,," and this is exactely what you need work out. as i said, its not just rounding over, but understanding the forms and interpreting them in a flat board... not meant to discourage, but to put focus on the things i think are essential in relief carving

[-JBergs-]

Okay, there's appears to be a lot to chew on here - or visualize I should say.

Doris I think I understand your concept of seeing it in a "compressed form," or flattened as you said... but that leaves a lot to the imagination to determine ... in other words, in my opinion, an artist may paint or draw much better than the next person because their spatial ability is that much better; where they can imagine and visualize the scene or object (or whatever they're painting/drawing) in their mind whereas a less experienced artist may have trouble doing that.

I think it is this skill that I'm trying to develop. Perhaps it's not a skill at all and it's that innate ability or natural talent that allows one to picture the "thing" perfectly in their mind, consistently, allowing them to transport it to the canvas, sketchbook, or in our case, the wood.

I sometimes lose that picture in my mind and I think that’s why relief carving can be such a challenge because your design and patter drawn or transferred to the wood is in 2D and the final work is in 3D… so there’s an element of design, the ranging depths, being left to the imagination to determine as you progress in the work.

I know some actually mark the letter H for high points and L for low points on the 2D pattern and perhaps they keep reapplying these as they progress through the carving…

I think I’ll have to get in the habit of doing this same thing so I don’t have to rely solely on my imagination or memory of what my original design intent was.

Remember, I’m at the very beginning here and it seems there are so many elements to concentrate on at the same time.

Guess my original intent in this question was to try and establish some sort of routine that I can take with me on every carving – something that will help me make sense of the steps in the work because I know I’m reinventing the wheel here in many instances trying to do this on my own.

Thanks – and sorry for the longer than usual response…

[doris]

i am sorry if i did intimadate you. yes, the basic outline of reliefcarving is as you listed in the numbers 1-4. my suggestion is, pic a nice not too complicated project, and just start doing it. you will see how many things "fall into place" once you started working on them. its not so much thinking more working on it and seeing what needs be done next. just go try it now, its not necessary to figure out all in mind before starting...and, if you have problems to visualise you can always make a quick model in clay to see how it should be carved. i truely hope my comments were helpful and not discouraging.

[Irish]

Hey JBerg,

Step 3 for me includes the following:

1. Establish the basic levels in the pattern - far background or 'sky' area, background, mid-ground, foreground and sometimes extreme foreground.

2. Mark the levels on my project board with a pencil number so that I know as I carve where each element will fall in depth.

3. Rough out the basic levels to a predetermined depth in the wood.

4. Re-trace the pattern to each level area.

5. Begin the general shaping of each element.

Obviously I do use levels for relief work. I find that mentally then actually dividing a pattern into at least three basic areas of depth - background, mid-ground and foreground - helps me to insecure that each element or grouping of elements is where it belongs before I begin the shaping and sculpturing steps.

I work the first rough out cuts so that each level is left a little proud (high) from it's final depth. This leaves me manuveuring room, room to change the element, add extra work or details. I can always remove excess wood later but I can't put it back once I have carved it off.

I usually work the entire carving in the top one half depth of the wood. So a 2" board means a 1" deep carving for me. I divide that carving depth, in this sample 1", by the number of levels I find in the pattern. If I am doing a landscape with a background mountains, mid-ground barn complex and foreground tree and mailbox, I would divide by three knowing that I will carve the sky and clouds would be worked at the 1/2 depth point.

So I would have one section for the sky and clouds 1" deep into the wood and then three levels above that. I do adjust how much depth each level gets with the background having the least and the level with the focus point or focus element the most. So for the landscape it might be 1/4" for the background mountains, 1/2" for the barn complext mid-ground and 1/4" for the foreground tree and mailbox.

Once you have your levels you can work them again adding new levels - the mountains might have a line of trees at their base so the trees would be higher than the mountains but all worked in the background level.

A carving pattern that starts out with three basic levels can be divided over and over again as you work through your steps. By the time your carving is done you won't see the original levels at all but you will be guarenteed that each element lies where it should in depth in the carving.

For anyone new at relief carving I strongly suggest trying a few carvings using levels. By learning to 'think' in levels, learning to group elements into a background, mid-ground, foreground arrangement you learn to take time to really explore your pattern, know what you are going to carve and how to place them exactly where you want them in depth in the work.

The other strong reason I use levels is that it teaches a new carver to work the entire pattern not one specific area at a time. By dropping everything down to it's level in the rough out stage then doing a general shaping to every element and then refining that shaping to take each element into a sculptured look you are forced to work a little on everything in the design.

Too often a newbie to relief gets sort of 'stuck' working on one particular element in the pattern, trying to work that one element to a finished carving while ignoring the rest of the design.

Tracing the pattern to the board, grabbing your tools and tackling that barn complex in our sample, working those barns until they are about finished means that every other part ofthe pattern now must be worked off of just that barn. The carved barn determines everything and the carving becomes a 'one element' work instead of a complete flowing landscape.

Just my thoughts.

Susan

[-JBergs-]

Thank you both Doris and Irish for contributing greatly in your responses to me. I feel privileged to have such talented carvers giving me such thorough responses so thanks again.

Doris, you did not intimidate or discourage me in any way; I really appreciate any insight you can give – I think you shouldn’t “soften” or hold back at all when explaining your techniques for fear of discouraging the newbies here – so again thank you for sharing. I definitely appreciate your advice to “just start doing it” … and I am … funny enough, while I am carving is when I keep my blackberry next to me to jot down the questions I have to later post on this forum … it’s been a great help to do so.

Irish; Wow! Thanks for your in depth response!
From my understanding of your post; it seems I can summarize by saying that I need to be well prepared before and during the carving, having a good idea of which elements fall into which “level” – and to start with 3 distinct levels and later, as the design permits, add more. I should be carving with the whole work in mind as opposed to concentrating on and finishing one element at a time.

I realize after considering all the posts that each experienced carver has his/her own techniques that work for them. And with more experienced carvers skill levels can still range. Some are more artistic in their approach and rely more on intuition then preparation while some view their work mechanically. Both are artists in their own way. I realize in this forum one must be prudent in the advice they take but I think my best bet is to appreciate and strongly consider each technique a more experienced carver brings to the table – and “just start doing it” as doris said.

One of my biggest problems, as doris touched on, is thinking I have to have everything figured out and set in my mind before I pick up a tool.

It was just yesterday when I was doing some more practice on a piece of pine that my frivolous design turned into a beautiful, choppy running river as it swerved and swayed around the landscape. Now I have an idea of how to carve a water landscape – which would have never came to me had I not been just practicing without getting hung up on all the details.

So again thank you doris, pallin, and Irish (in the order of posts) for all your help!

I’m always open to any and all feedback.