eyes and cheeks

[p3aul]

I'm having a problem rounding eyes in relief carvings of horses. I do these in low-relief. I can use a v-tool or knive blade to trace around the eye or the cheek of woodspirit for instance, but I can't seem to get that rounded all-over shape. any suggestions? I learn more from reading posts than I do from a book.
Thanks,
Paul

[Robert Cahill]

I seldom do relief carvings but in a Santa Ornament tutorial by Gary McDaniel he used a skew tool to round the eye. I would imagine it would work well in relief also. Hopefully others will jump in with other suggestions.

[mpounders]

Is it in profile or from straight ahead? I might understand the problem better if you could post a picture of what is giving a problem (or might not!). Gary Mc does have some great eye videos though and a skew or "pelican" shaped blade might help. I try to think of it as like shading a drawing....you create shadows by cutting those areas deeper or undercutting. The deeper the cut, the darker the shadow. So a rounded ball would have different shadows depending on where the light is coming from or where your viewpoint is from. From straight ahead, the shadows are deeper in both corners of the eye than in the center, and not quite as deep where it goes under the upper and lower lids. Draw an eye on a piece of scrap, and cut the corners deeper and then round off what is left into more of a rounded ball shape. But remember that on a human face, the eyeball also slants in and down, because the lower lid doesn't stick out as far as the upper.

[p3aul]

Thanks guys I will try those suggestions. I guess what I'm trying to say is i want to carve a portion of a sphere as that's what the eyeball is and you only see a portion of it Rounding cheeks seems like would present the same problem. i guess, like you say, trial and error on a scrap piece, but that's basically what I've been doing, with no good results.
Paul

[mpounders]

Not sure if it will help, but here is an intaglio carving. The background is not relieved in this style of carving, but the techniques for doing the face are the same as a relief. The areas that are darker or shadowed are carved deeper, even if it is only fractions of an inch. It still makes the syes and cheeks rounded, because they actually do have a curved, ball shape. This is carved into a plate, so it is not real thick wood. But I tried to make it deeper in the creases and each side of the eye, and the crease by the nose, and the sides of the cheek. Painting also accentuated the shadows and gave it more dimension. I really like the folds on the hat. Something that really helped me with eyes was an old video by Lynn Doughty. He talked about actually carving the eye mound on the face, like it was half of an orange stuck on there. And then cutting the lids on that and define the round eyeball inside those lids. Hope this helps!

[p3aul]

Well I don't understand about the shadows, not as they pertain to carving anyway. A horse's eyeball is almost completely black. If you are carving the eye, you are shaping it anyway. I like the bit about Lynn Doughty.

Something that really helped me with eyes was an old video by Lynn Doughty. He talked about actually carving the eye mound on the face

I can't imagine any other way of doing it. I know that making a stop cut around the eyeball or cheeks and I make a 45 degree cut beside the stop cut but my eyeball and cheeks remain flat and unrealistic.

[mpounders]

Why don't you post some pictures of what you are asking about, then maybe someone can explain it better. Maybe some pictures would help.

Picture1: t if you draw a circle on a piece of wood and then outline it with a stop cut, it will still look just like a circle.

Picture2: If you outline that circle (outside) with a v-tool or 45 degree cut, it will look like a flat disc sitting on the wood.

Picture3: But if you then go around the inside of the circle and cut down to that outside circumference, you will start rounding it.

Picture4: It is not a flat 45 degree angle cut though; it is a rounded arc from the center of the circle to the outside, and if the circle is deep enough, you can shape into that half-ball shape.

[mpounders]

Picture1: Next, draw the upper and lower lids on the mound you just made and make a shallow stop cut to outline.

Picture2: Make a stab cut in each corner to remove a triangular chip to start establishing the eyeball beneath the lids.

Picture3: Continue to round the eyeball and cut it under the lids slightly. A small angled skew or a pelican shaped blade can be handy for shaping the eyeball. If you look at profile of an eye, the upper lid closes down over the lower lid and the eye slants back a bit from top to bottom.

Picture4: Make sure the lower lid is overlapped by the upper and smooth the transition to the cheek. Make a small shallow cut following above the upper lid to kinda indicate where the eyelashes are, if you want. The pupil and iris are drawn in and outlined with a shallow stop cut. You can also cut them out, in order to create a shadow that makes them look darker, but that is a little more advanced.

I hope this helps some!

[mpounders]

Well darn! It didn't post the second set of pictures I attached, so let me try again!

[rickm]

if you look at arleens video on cone santas there is a link on the forum she has a pretty good way of doing it if i understand the question correctly. its carverswoodshop