[arbarnhart]

I notice a lot of loyalty to the sponsor when folks ask about books. I do appreciate the effort and expense involved in hosting the forums, but a wider selection of books and better prices on the same books are found elsewhere. I did make one remark about the higher prices without putting two and two together and figuring out that WCI=FC. But I assume that it is okay to answer a post with recommendations other than FC books. In one case, I had recommended a book published by FC at another site and somone foloowed up with an FC link for the same book at a significantly higher price. It was my "why on Earth?" response that got me digging to figure out the connection. Anyway, please let me know the policy, if there is one.

[Paul_Guraedy]

I have been a member of this board for a couple of years now and think I have some insight into the general feelings of the group. We are all grateful to Fox Chapel and Wood Carving Illustrated for sponsering this woodcarving site. I also believe that it is more familiarity than exclusivity in recommending a particular company as a source for an item (Lil Shavers, Fox Chapel, etc.). At the same time, there are many, myself included, who prefer to purchase from those who are direcly involved in woodcarving (Fox Chapel vs. Amazon) even though the price might be higher.

Fox Chapel is undoubtedly the largest publisher of woodcarving books active today. Most books are not purchased directly from a publisher and new woodcarvers are often not aware of the variety available from this source.

Now, the above two paragraphs are my view of the way the list operates. From a personal standpoint, I have recommended books that were not published by Fox Chapel and have given a source for their purchase. I have also recommended books that were published by Fox Chapel. In this case, I have noted their availablity from the publisher; but, have left it up to the purchaser to seek other sources if they are seeking a lower price. I personally feel a sense of obligation to Wood Carving Illustrated (Fox Chapel) for their sponsership of this website. For that reason, I would not recommend, on this list, a cheaper source for a book they had published.

There do not appear to be any rules on this subject. It appears to be left up to the judgement of the individual posting the message or responding to another posting.

I hope that your feelings on this issue will not prevent you from further participation on the board. This is the most non-contentious group that I have ever seen and I don't think anyone was trying to restrict book purchases to Fox Chapel.

[arbarnhart]

I own some of their books and subscribe to one of their magazines and will probably subscribe to the other soon and I appreciate the forums. I intend to continue participating. I do get used craft books whenever possible (and that is usually possible even in the first year of publication) and recommend the alternative to others. Besides the cost savings, there are more trees left to carve, right?

[muffy]

I Agree With You Paul, One Hundred Percent.. Very Well Written..dan...

[Mitchell]

Paul covered it very well. As the person that recommeded the FC list, I feel I should join in. As a moderator, I am not paid by FC, but do feel some loyalty.....it's only natural. But that is not the reason I referenced the Fox Chapel list.

If you refer back to the thread in question, I supplied a link for the book that you mentioned AND a list of several more. The purpose was not to "push" FC (at least not directly), but to provide options. I also wanted to remind readers that the option of having a list of books was available through this site. IF I had objected to your referencing another source, I would have removed the post. I realized there was a price difference, but provided the link because I was more familiar with the source and the opportunity to show other books also.

I don't think the powers-to-be would object to us listing other possible sources - but this site will not allowed to be a direct means of outside advertising. As Paul mentioned, many posters here will refer others to Little Shavers even though they are not affilated with this forum. This is done because they provide a great service. The owner (Rick) posts here and is well respected. I'm sure that there are alternate (less expensive) sources, but again, we feel some loyalty to Rick because he is knowledgeable and helpful. We also mention articles from the "other" magazines. I think discussing those articles is within the guidelines of this forum.

By the way, I chuckled a little bit when you mentioned the price....realizing that you didn't catch the connection. I am impressed that you did a little detective work to figure it out. Actually, I don't use Amazon. By referencing other sources, you - and others - are only helping all of us...which is part of the reason this forum is provided in the first place.

If anyone has a question about what may be within the guidelines of the board, please feel free to PM a moderator, BobD, or the admin.

[Just Carving]

Whenever I purchase a book, I use www.addall.com to determine who has the book and at what price. I have been using the Addall website since I was in graduate school, and it can save you a significant amount of money especially if you are willing to purchase a used book. It also helps determine the shipping cost and gives you a link to the seller's website.

I can purchase from Barnes & Noble if they have it in stock and should get it in 2-3 days since they ship from their warehouse about 15 miles from here. Sometimes, B&N takes 4-5 days and other times, 1-2 days. No ryhme or reason?!?!

But if I can purchase the same book from FC, and the price and the shipping are equal to the closest and cheapest provider, then I'll buy from FC. They're close--PA--reliable, and consistent with their shipping.

Bottom line, I'm the customer, and whoever serves me the best gets my business.

[Kenny_S]

Well said Paul and in agreement. I do have some books that arn't from Fox P but were bought or given before I became a member several years ago. If someone ask me what I want for Christmas, I show them Fox's web site and now littleshavers.

Now I have bought from woodcraft but they get theirs from Fox, so, guess, I still buy from Fox. Glad they are around and supports woodcarving. We have an Amazon warehouse/ distribution center less than 25 miles away in Coffeyville Ks, but I look for where Fox has their books.
Merry Christmas

[BobD]

Just an official weigh in here:

I'm always going to suggest you look at the books available from FCP, but I'm a big proponent of buying locally. If you're near our office in East Petersburg, by all means, stop in and buy here. Buy from our website. Buy from anyone else's website. It really doesn't matter!

The way we look at it, we'll always have a website where people can buy books; we also send out cataloges for people to buy books. But stop by our booth at a show; we will be selling back issues, T-shirts, and we display books but we don't sell them. At shows, we are there to support our retailers--those vendors who sell our books. We don't want to compete with them!

The main thing is that you like our books and get them (legally) somehow!

Perhaps it's my "support the little guy attitude," my parents' hardware store was put out of business by a large chain who will remain unnammed. I try to buy most of my tools and materials locally from smaller retailers; I go to a family owned sawmill to buy most of my lumber, buy tools locally, and shop at smaller stores for any presents I don't make.


Bob

[squbrigg]

I am often asked to recommend books for new carvers, and there are a couple of titles that I usually suggest. If the person is looking for something more specific, then I direct them to check out Fox Chaples site because of their wide variety on the one site and ease of shopping. The local bookstore doesn't carry carving books, at all, even when suggested. Nor do they carry much else that I enjoy reading, but that's another problem. The big box book stores, I find too clumbersome, trying to find up to date, new or just plain good, woodcarving books. No carving stores around here, no big box stores either, so the mail order or internet is my option for carving information and supplies.

I got so frustrated not being able to find good carving books or direct folks to them locally, that I have begun carrying a limited quantity of their books at my ship modelling and carving display during the summer. I'm not a business, more like providing a service to a few folks who are interested in carving and who visit the display looking for help. Fox Chaple have been super nice helping me set it up and providing me with catalogues and such, of course I'm going to recommend them to anyone who is looking for a good book on the subject. Bob and his folks there do a splendid job and provide a great product and super service at reasonable prices. Yes, I am loyal and proud of it. Why would I send anyone elsewhere?

Bob

[DiamondWillow]

:

I have 4 carving/painting books that were sitting in the closet and wife said SELL them.. LOL Is it appropriate to list the ebay address where to find them?

If it isn't I certainly understand.

Gene