Proportions I've observed

[Wildbirdcarver]

It is my opinion that nature is consistent in it's proportions. Please post observations that you have noted. Here is an example for a song bird.
1. the base of the neck is egg shaped and is 2/3 of the size of the widest part of the bird's body.
2. the head is about 1/2 the size of the widest part of the bird's body.
3. the body is about 3-3.5 times as long as the head of the bird.
4. the base of the tail...where it attaches to the body...is 1/2 or less than the widest part of the bird's body.
5. the length of the middle toe plus the hind toe is equal to the length of the tip of the bill to the back of the head.
6. There are many more...jump in here and have fun.
Of course these are all approximations to you have to read the reference.
What have you noticed about other bird species, (hawk, shore birds, etc)
animals, people, plants, etc? Thanks, Dick M

[songbirds]

Well, since a bird chances its appearance by trapping air, attracting a mate, etc. there are too many variables and species. I think i will continue to due my measurements of each species, but interesting.
Jerry

[brian-bailey]

I find that proportions are important, but also realize that they can get distorted with perspective such as foreshortening.

So, when I look at something, I'm identifying it as a shape either negative or positive.

[Wildbirdcarver]

Thanks for your comments. Proportions are not the complete answer and do not take the place of measurements. Jerry is very correct. Proportions help me to capture the essence of a songbird and know that I'm in the ball park with the measurements. Relationships are very important also. For instance the widest part of the bird's beak is just in front of the eyes, and is as wide as the distance between the bird's eyes. I believe that if we study our reference material for measurements, proportions, and relationships we will gain a lot more information. Learning to "see" is harder than to "look" IMHO. Thanks again.

[brian-bailey]

Originally Posted by Wildbirdcarver

Learning to "see" is harder than to "look" IMHO. Thanks again.

If you don't look, how can you see?

Measurements whether by eye or ruler will capture the details, but artistic endeavors seem to me to strive for something more.

If I carve a song bird perched on a branch, certainly I would want it to be anatomically and proportionally correct. How else would someone recognize it as a song bird.

But say I want to capture the essence of the bird straining to reach a seed just out of its reach while also fighting to stay balanced on the branch.

My mental image of this scenario reveals to me that a lot of the proportions and measurements of a static bird will not be correct.

IMHO, measurements and proportions are important but strict adherence to them might constrain you artistically.

[Wildbirdcarver]

Hey Brian, glad you added another demention to this thread. Absolutely the artistic quality to a bird carving...or any other carving...is what separates a good carving to a very pleasing carving. Maybe that is why some carvers make the clay model. I never have, but will think seriously about it from now on. That would help get all (some) of the factors to balance...proportions, measurements, relationships and artistic qualities. What other factors can we add to this thread?

[brian-bailey]

Wildbirdcarver, thanks for responding back, I was afraid that my posts might have unintentionally ruffled a few feathers. I have a history of doing that on this forum.

The observations that you made in your first post are similar to what I do when observing (seeing) a subject that is of interest to me.
I'm just more shape orientated and that is what I was trying to convey in my post.

I have a friend that carves birds right down to excruciating detail. My friend is not an artist, so the birds are mere specimens lacking life that someone interested the artsy side would instill in them. They are nice to look at, just nothing special.

Here is something that I have found interesting in my studies of human proportions.

The average male today is proportionally 7 heads tall, but most people don't consider that as ideal. They consider an 8 head figure more handsome and elegant.

Sometimes I get a swollen head, so for awhile I'm in the 8 heads arena, but mostly I get by in life in the 7 heads realm.

Brian...

[Blackjaxe]

I might as well throw in my nickles worth.

I have always felt that working from careful observation is the best route. Study skins are great for identifing feather groups but colours fade and skins shrink and dry-up so unless its fresh you can get the wrong information. Photographs can be very deceiving, most are shot with a telephoto lens and that gives you forshortning and depending on who printed or manipulated the finished photo the colours can be a lot different.
Brian's view is right on, I would rather see a so-so carved bird with artistic flair than a perfect anotomical version just sitting on a branch.....nicely done but uninteresting. Turn the head, tuck in a wing, have him or her preening a tail feather. How many times in observing birds have we seen them sitting on a branch with one leg tucked up underneath yet in almost every carving I've viewed no-one including myself has ever carved a songbird this way.
Measurements are a neccesity in carving anything, but always consider where your source material is and make adjustments to fit the carving. Hens are usually larger than cock birds and if the bird is at rest they will appear plumper than a bird ready to take off or is in danger or a cock bird at the height of breeding season.

Ken

[Wildbirdcarver]

I need to learn how to spell dimension! Duh. Thanks for adding the quality of action and reading reference correctly. All these factors are important. Having the animal/bird doing something is a lot more pleasing than if it is stiff and static. Also the entire sculpture is better if it tells a story...IMHO.

[brian-bailey]

Originally Posted by Wildbirdcarver

Having the animal/bird doing something is a lot more pleasing than if it is stiff and static. Also the entire sculpture is better if it tells a story...IMHO.

I don't know if you watch American Idol or not but one of the Judges, Simon Cowell, is constantly advising the contestants to do more than just stand there and sing. He'll advise when critiquing their performance, You've got a great voice, but you need to do something more than just stand there and sing! You've got to create a WOW factor so that you're not just another singer easily forgotten five minutes from now.

If you can capture that WOW in your work, you'll have something.