[Cap Crutch]

Hello, all,

I'm a new carver and plan to try some larger carvings out of logs, and I've been reading that a useful tool is a firmer gouge for removing waste that you can't get with the bandsaw or chainsaw or whatever.

I would like to get one of these tools, but I am unsure what size and sweep to get. I plan to work with harder softwoods and some hardwoods (cherry, walnut, maybe some ruff outdoor work in white oak), so I want something fairly versatile.

Edit: I also only want to buy ONE of them for a while.

My question is, what is a good width for my application? I was looking at some Two Cherries firmer gouges that I think had a #11 sweep, an outcannel bevel and sizes from I think maybe 1/2" wide up to over 1" wide.

For some reason, 3/4" wide sounded "right" as a compromise to me, even though I have nothing to base that on. Can anyone give me any advice on this?

Also, is a #11 sweep the way to go? (I already have straight bench chisels and want a gouge rather than a chisel, though maybe I don't need an #11 sweep. My theory is that it's an #11 for strength, but again, I'm a total newbie, so please bear with my ignorance.)

Thank you for reading my question and thanks in advance for any advice.

[mdallensr]

Cap, I'm not sure how Two Cherries numbers their sweeps, but I think a #11 is a veiner, and that's probably not the sweep you want. You need a deep gouge, say from a #7 to a #9, and at least 3/4" wide. You don't want to bury the gouge in the wood so you need to keep the corners above the surface of the wood, making repeated cuts that are under control. A firmer gouge is the right kind of tool for that heavy work. Hopefully Colin will weigh in on this post, since tree carving is his specialty. We had a member who carved totem poles, Alfie Fishgap, and he would have good suggestions to but I haven't seen a post from him for quite a while. I watched him work on a totem pole at the WCI Open House and he had gouges that looked like pancake flippers! Good luck. Mike

[Cap Crutch]

Thank you Mike. I found a Diefenbacher 3/4" firmer gouge with a #8 sweep on Amazon for $16 which is WAY cheaper than the Two Cherries. However the Diefenbacher is heat treated to Rc58 and the Two Cherries (I think) to Rc61. I'm not sure how hard a tool like that should be...I'm guessing softer/tougher than my Rc61 regular carving gouges, but I'm not sure...Thanks again for your reply.

[Don by the lake]

I just bought a Pfeil #5 sweep because I like the #5 for the smaller carvings. I also have a #7 and I probably use that one more. Both are about an inch wide. I was using a #11 last week and ended up spending three hours repairing it because it chipped on my carving. I guess it was too delicate for what I was doing. I was working with green ash and I am just recently doing some bigger work. I used my chainsaw to rough it in, and now I am doing the details with mallet and chisel.

[Plain_Ol_Ed]

Originally Posted by Cap Crutch

Thank you Mike. I found a Diefenbacher 3/4" firmer gouge with a #8 sweep on Amazon for $16 which is WAY cheaper than the Two Cherries. However the Diefenbacher is heat treated to Rc58 and the Two Cherries (I think) to Rc61. I'm not sure how hard a tool like that should be...I'm guessing softer/tougher than my Rc61 regular carving gouges, but I'm not sure...Thanks again for your reply.

RC58 is just fine. And yes, a little softer usually equates to tougher. I doubt you can tell the difference between 58 and 61. They are only guessing at how hard the tool is anyway. It's a very educated guess and very close, but might be off a point or two.

[Cap Crutch]

Thank you Don and Ed. Do you (or anyone else here) have any opinions on the Diefenbacher gouge I mentioned (#8 sweep, 3/4" wide), or on Diefenbacher carving tools in general?

I'm trying to get by on as few cutting tools as I can in the beginning, because I can see where it could get crazy down the road!

[Don by the lake]

I have already gone crazy. I have bunches of tools and none of them are cheap stuff. My sister bought a cheap China set from ebay and she asked me what I thought of them and I told her to throw them away. As far as the brand you mentioned I don't know anything about them. I started out with Ramelson and Flexcut. Now I am getting into Pfeil tools which I really like. Every time I take a class, I usually see some tools the instructor is using and I have to have them. The good thing is " I only need just a couple more"

[Plain_Ol_Ed]

A #8 sounds about right sweepwise for what you want to do. Depending on the size of the logs your dealing with it might be a bit on the narrow side. Best wait on the width thing until Colin shows up.

Diefenbacher has a good reputation. Can't speak to the tools from personal experience as I don't have any. But if I remember correctly they are made by Dastra in Germany. I have a couple Dastra palm tools that are fine.

[Hi_Ho_Sliver]

Don't throw the cheap tools away! Give them to a newbie....great practice for sharpening rather than mess up a good expensive tool

[Plain_Ol_Ed]

Not only that, most of them have excellent steel in them. Just need a bunch of work to get them tuned up.