Beginner knife sharpness question

[MonkeyKnifeFight]

Hey folks. So I decided to try to learn how to do some hand carving. I did some research and then went to my local Woodcraft to get some advice and they ended up recommending I get two Butz carving knives which I did. I am totally new so it took me awhile to realize the knives were utterly dull. I mean they don't even have a bevel. My initial attempts were like trying to carve with chopsticks.

So I took the knives back to the woodcraft to try to get them to sharpen them and they seemed really surprised how dull they were. They took them to sharpen them and said that when I got them back they would be razor sharp. So I got them back but the guy acted like it was tough to get an edge on them since he had to start with no bevel at all. I got the knives home and they are sharper but definitely not razor sharp. They won't cut through paper and trying to carve with them is pretty tough. They really tear the wood apart.

So i'm wondering if the problems i'm running into (knives not wanting to cut through wood) are because I'm a newbie or if it's a problem with the knives. I'm using basswood which everyone says should be easy to cut through. I see videos online where guys take big chunks out of the wood without too much effort while i'm struggling to hack away little pieces. Any advice on what I should do? I'm going to have some free time in the next week or so and I'd like to try my hand at this but it's getting kind of frustrating that I keep going into Woodcraft and spending money but can't seem to get a sharp knife. Should i get some kind of stone and try to get them sharp myself? I see there are Xacto knives that work for woodcarving. Would I be better off going to Home Depot and getting one of these and then ordering a sharpened knife online? I checked out a couple other knives at Woodcraft which were also dull so I don't think they're going to be able to hook me up with a sharp knife.

Thanks!

[carver33]

Although Butz knives are not as highly thought of as others, they should be pretty decent. I've seen that they require honing before use - as do many tools. Proper sharpening is a skill that takes a little time to learn, so my recommendation would be to sent the knives to Rick Ferry for the initial sharpening (here):

Sharpening Service at Little Shavers

[btree50]

I have a Butz knife and love it. They do need to be honed before use.
Search the threads here, or the internet, for the scary sharp method. All you need is a flat surface and sand paper. Lots of good ideas here for sharpening.
JimB

[Mitchell]

Bill and Jim give good advice above.

The people at Woodcraft should/could have been more helpful - but not all are familiar with carving.

If you have access to a club I'd recommend going - most of the time they will help.

Carving with a dull knife is not fun and is dangerous.

[SlowMover]

I too am an afficianado of Butz knives. They do not come with a bevel, and that is why I like them...I sharpen them by just lying them flat on a stone or scary sharp plate and sharpen. No problem reproducing the angle because it is zero. If the guys at Woodcraft put a bevel on your knives, then they probablly should give you a new knife (in my opinion)..they came from the factory in the correct condition. Without a bevel, the knives will need to be honed or stropped more freuently than some other brands to maintain an edge, but for me that is not a problem...I can sharpen Butz knives easier and better than any others I own...just my opinion. If you are still having problems with your knives, check out some of the posts by Lynn Dougherty at Out West Gallery (links can be found on one of his posts) and see what he can do with a utility knife..you can get utility knife pretty cheap and carve most everything with it if you want. Keep hanging in there and once you get a sharp knife and learn how to keep it that way the carving will be enjoyable.

[TreeWizard]

That's good advice form Slow, try to google scary sharp and you will get some great information on how to sharpen your own knife. While Rick at little shavers does a wonderful job, it's always best to know you can get it done by yourself so you don't have to wait for the shipping back and forth to the west coast.

[AlArchie]

Buying a "first" knife seems to be one of the most problematic choices a beginner has to make. MOST over the counter knives need to be sharpened and stropped before using, and that puts a beginner at a great disadvantage.

The one exception I've noticed is the Flexcut knives. I'm not a great fan of these knives but they do come razor sharp, right from the package. There are many other excellent carving knives out there and everyone has their own "favorites. My particular one is the Stanley "Whittli'n Jack", a knife no longer available. It's a big, sort of clunky knife with a stainless steel blade that did not come pre sharpened. After about an hour's work with stone and strop, mine sings for me. And I prefer a blade with a 15 to 20 degree bevel for most carving. Again, there are differences in preference on the bevel. I have one custom blade with a flat bevel and I love it, for some tasks, but it too is not a "one size fits all" tool.

I only mention this to point out the importance of learning to sharpen your own knives. It takes practice and it's best to find someone who can give you personal instruction.

Some carving stores and suppliers sell all their blades sharpened and honed......Rick Ferry from Little Shavers is one. I believe Smokey Mountain Wood Carvers is another. But unless you live right there you will have to order their knives.

I'd go back to Woodcraft and see if you can swap those knives out for a Flexcut. I've been to several Woodcraft stores and though they are quite helpful, most of the personell are not carvers and definitely not well versed in sharpening techniques for carving knives. Ask if they have a wood carver on staff and if they do speak directly with him/her.

Al

[Gulf Coast Handyman]

I sharpened my Butz knife using this method, YouTube - sharpening secret #1, I used 220 grit paper and layed the knife flat. Good luck, it takes practice, but it does work!

Dave

[Gulf Coast Handyman]

I have a second disc with leather / compound, which you would use after the sandpaper. Total dollars spent, around $20.00

Dave

[MonkeyKnifeFight]

Hey everyone thanks for all the comments. The message was in moderator limbo long enough that yesterday I did some research and went and bought a fixed blade utility knife from Home Depot. I'm glad I did. I was getting pretty frustrated with my Butz knives because I didn't know if the problems I was having were due to a dull knife or my own inexperience. Now I know it was the former (mostly). With my new utility knife I've had a super fun day that has been far more productive than all my time with my Butz knives. I'm not making high art but at least I can make cuts.

I'm still wondering about the knives I did buy though. The first guy who sold me the knives didn't seem to be an expert in the hand carving but as a newbie he seemed to know enough to give me advice. The folks in the shop definitely don't know that the Butz knives comes with no bevel because they've all been surprised. Honestly I would prefer a nice woodcarving knife over my new utility knife but I'm gonna wait till I can get something sharp.

So I hope I can beg some more advice. It seems like it's a 'thing' for knives to come with no bevel. Is this so the owner can then sharpen the knife to the exact edge they want? It seems strange because customized edge angles seem like something an experienced carver would care about but Butz knives seem like kind of intro knives. So still what should I do? Now that I've seen how sharp the utility knife is I know that the 'sharpened' Butz knives are dull in comparison. Should I send them off somewhere to an expert who can really sharpen them? Should I take the opportunity to learn how to sharpen them myself? The guy who tried at Woodcraft seemed like he knew about hand carving so I'm skeptical I can do better than him. I'm happy to get into the hobby and learn about sharpening but at this point I'd like to mess around some with actual carving before I know I really want to commit. And it seems like it would be easier to learn sharpening starting with a somewhat sharp knife.