Artist Talent vs Carving Tool technique

[BobD]

Try being a writer for an international magazine...I'll show you PC...

Bob

[Kenny_S]

Bovine Secretion is a lot of Bull. Art is that to some!

[JIM QUILICI]

I kan't xplane what art is ....... but I knose it when I sees it.
Just old Jim

[Kenny_S]

Without some sort of ARt talent a person doesn't have Carving tool techniques.

HUMMMMMMMM, maybe that is what is wrong with me!

[Thomp]

My wife and i have this discussion frequently, she is so invious of anybody with any art skill.

as i told her art isen't in us when were born its a learned, practised skill, like anything else, if were taught good reproducable technique and keep an adventurious spirit, keep the techniques practiced so our eye hand coordination is good, we can preform our artistic talent the rest of our lives... and improve our skills as we teach ourselves through adventurious means and methods...

but i believe there is one bigger thing i didn't mention, its art appriciation, if we dont appriciate art we wont want to try to reproduce or create art we see or dream up on our own.....

---
This conversation all started after i carved a ball in cage, back when the fourm was going through a recent flurish of whimsical carvings.

She has never carved except the eyes out of a potato, i set her down one day with a block of basswood mapped out and a good sharp chip knife, with my best kevlar glove, and instructed her how to use the knife, not just to push the knife but to draw it a little as she made her cuts, small chips only, and she carved a ball in cage, after 3 days, she had a good representation of the same ball i carved, but when the ball was released and loose she was done.. we got to practise finishing things. now..

but it showed her everybody has some artistic ability if they are given the right instruction.

I have always loved to create, paper and ink, paint, whittling, sand painting or just scratching in the dirt,.

its all art i think never the less what medium, wheather its clay markings on animal hides, or granit stone carvings some is just a little more perminate than others,

[dutchmanmk3]

Skills, and Techniques can be taught, and learned !

Talent is a Serendipitous combination of Natural Ability (relating to Spatial Concepts) and Personal Perspective !!!

Artistic/Talented personalities simply relate to their enviorment More effectively, and Actually View things differently.

This could be said of All Human Beings...But Art "IS" Subjective, and a matter of personal taste.

I've seen many pieces that were technically incorrect, but the Artist's Unique perspective, and imagination produced it's own individual charm, and character defiant of any logical standard.

This Life is Short, Savour the Magic anywhere you can get it !!! Jester

[Thomp]

I agree that art is in the eye of the beholder.

My Other 2 cents....

we are creatures of our experiances as we grow from babys through adulthood..
we are taught through our enviroment, and our experiances, as we grow through the stages as children, if were not tought anything about art were probobaly not going to respect it the same as someone that was introduced to art early and lived in a art rich inviroment all their lives... and taught about art..

the same respect for art wouldnt be recieved from a street rat, unless he was impressed at the beauty of gang tags on subway busses and walls as he made it through puberty.........

there both art.

but things like the other junk went arie becuse some ritzy spoiled kid went to art school, bought friendships through wild partys, wemon and free drugs with inherited money.
just becuse he thinks his education makes him an artist, and his experiments of stacking crap. is art, i cannot see rewarding that kind of way of thinking, in the art community..

[dutchmanmk3]

Most days I feel as If I am simply Paul Parroting Heritage, and History, and It's not always a Warm Fuzzy Creative Feeling. I'm merely restoring or preserving craft, but I'm obligated by guild and trade to respect, and preserve that craft.

This is why I enjoy coming here. I'm like a kid in a candy store when I see everyones original projects, and it Catalyzes my creative energy, and Inspires Me !!! Thumbs Up

I just can't thank everyone enough for That !

I use to make Rocking Horses after my daughter passed away. All Types, hundreds of patterns.

The Parents would come in and pick out a priceless heirloom, and the child would run up and jump on a purple dinosaur and hang on for dear life. Guess who won that argument ?

Art has to be felt to be appreciated. It has to move or inspire someone.

Too many folks try to critique it's worthiness or details, and label or evaluate the artist, and I reckon once you hang a price tag on it you're sticking your chin out. If it moves or inspires only one of God's creatures is it still art ?

[lorax]

Originally Posted by dutchmanmk3

Art has to be felt to be appreciated. It has to move or inspire someone.

Too many folks try to critique it's worthiness or details, and label or evaluate the artist, and I reckon once you hang a price tag on it you're sticking your chin out. If it moves or inspires only one of God's creatures is it still art ?

(I love this endless argument) For the record I am not sure there is a answer that suits everyone. I would like to turn to our sculptor brothers to illustrate this. The artists name escapes me, but a very snooty New York show, he entered a urinal with his name painted on it (it may have been a fountain) anyway- his point was that the "establishment" was dictating what art was (it was the modern art era) and that art does not neccesarily have definition. There- that justifies the small fortune spent at art school

[Blackjaxe]

I've been a Professional Artist for over 40 years. I have carefully read this entire thread a couple of times and agree with some of the comments about what is Art, how does a Hobbiest become a Artist and so on.
Before someone makes a staement that Talent can be learned they had better read a dictionary about what Talent really is. Talent is the innate ability to do something, be it music, art or whatever. It cannot be taught....PERIOD......Skill can be taught or acquired through many hours of repetive work. Anyone who thinks for one minute that they can compete with a naturally gifted person who has worked hard at their craft by simply putting in lots of time better think again. But at the same goes for a person who works hard at their craft can also outshine a person who has natural abilities but is also lazy and doesn't use that god-given abilitiy.
I have never understood how some moron who calls himself a Art Critic can determine for the rest of us what is or is not Great Art.
I have also taught art to adults and have instilled in my students that they have to first accept where they are in their artistic pursuit and accept where they are at any given time.
Personally I think that if a person creates anything from scratch such as a painting, carving or even a wooden chair they become artist or artisans in their own right. You cannot give a person high marks as a artist if they paint a copy of the Mona Lisa, that right goes to Leonardo DaVinci and the same applies to anyone who takes a pattern out of a book and carves it exactly as decribed in the same book......what have you achieved........absolutely nothing as far as art is concerned ...you copied someone elses art, but what you did achieve is a better understanding of what is needed to do a piece you can truly call your own.....I have never been to Ocean City and the Ward Competition but I think that most of the bigger ribbons and prizes go to those who show originality in their carving.
I have worked hard to hone my abilities as a working artist, I had to. If I didn't I would probably be a welder or auto mechanic or whatever. There are times when I have regreted my decision to stay on this road, their have been very few rewards....pats on the back don't pay the rent and nice comments about your abilities will not buy you a cup of coffee. And as far a self satisfaction about your abilities and what you can creat with what appears to be so little effort on your part, maybe thats why I've never had a ego to stroke after all these years.......now I'm into carving. Wish to God that I would have stumbled onto this 41 years ago......but who knows I probably wouldn't have the painting skills to finish my carvings.

Ken